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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3  Previous   Next
Theatrical Release Studio on the film The Good Son
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMerrik
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Registered: September 30, 2008
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Was wondering if anyone could help me out here.

Have gotten a no vote to a change I've made to a profile of The Good Son (just one part, I've submitted a few corrections to the profile). Not anything bad, the member voting no is an awesome guy here (and on other forums I've seen him on), he's been very helpful to me with issues I've had with the system, he's just voted no saying the change is incorrect. All good.

I've changed the Theatrical Release Studio from

Twentieth Century Fox Film

to

Twentieth Century Fox

If I'm wrong, I'll totally resubmit, got no issues with that.


Here's how the movie breaks down:

Opening Credits:
Opens with typical (90's) 20th Century Fox logo at the very start of the film.
Directly after that (literally the next thing on the screen) reads "Twentieth Century Fox presents"
No other studios listed during opening credits
Closing Credits:
Near the very end of the closing credits:
"Copyright © 1993 by Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation
All Rights Reserved
Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation is the author of this motion picture for purposes of copyright and other laws"
16 seconds later to end the film's closing credits
"Produced and Released by Twentieth Century Fox"




Soooo... which should it be?

(as a personal aside, just for me, the fact that I currently have 8 variants of Twentieth Century Fox in my local drives me nuts... I'll probably just change them all to Twentieth Century Fox and lock the shiitake mushroom out of my collection  )

Any help would be greatly appreciated, especially if I'm in the wrong here! Thanks 
The night is calling. And it whispers to me soflty come and play.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
Registered: December 27, 2009
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Twentieth Century Fox would be correct.

unless we are going to change all the Star Wars, Marvel films, Ice Age, Avatar, Planet of the Apes films to the other name. Which they are not in the database.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Here is what the Rules say:
Quote:
Do not abbreviate Studio or Media Company names. e.g, use Universal Pictures not just Universal; The Criterion Collection rather than Criterion or Criterion Collection; Walt Disney Pictures not just Disney. Exception: If the studio name is too long to fit, use standard abbreviation rules.

Omit company suffixes such as LLC, Ltd., Inc.

I can see why you might want to exclude "Corporation", but given this rule, why do you believe the word "Film" should be excluded?

---------------
 Last edited: by scotthm
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorrdodolak
Registered: March 18, 2007
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Besides the end credits, the MPAA film ratings site also corroborates the theatrical distributor as Twentieth Century Fox Film Corp.

https://www.filmratings.com/Search?filmTitle=good+son&x=0&y=0

What's nice about the program is that it has the flexibility to list different "studios" (theatrical, production, media) which in some cases may represent the different divisions of a parent company.  Such as:

Twentieth Century Fox Film Corp.
Fox Searchlight Pictures
Twentieth Century Fox Animation
Twentieth Century Fox Home Entertainment

Walt Disney Studios Motion Pictures
Walt Disney Pictures
Buena Vista Home Entertainment

etc.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMerrik
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Registered: September 30, 2008
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
I can see why you might want to exclude "Corporation", but given this rule, why do you believe the word "Film" should be excluded?

---------------


I don't mean any offense, don't take any, I just wanted to get more than one opinion.

I don't think the word film should be excluded, I don't think it's actually part of it. Big difference. You're taking the company from the copyright notice. I'm taking it from what's being presented on the actual film (in no less than 3 different places, all of which exclude it).

If we use what's written in the copyright section of the credits and only that (the copyright holder, to my knowledge isn't necessarily the theatrical distributor), then... damn... I gotta say, we're in trouble. I've never seen a single person enter Universal or Universal Pictures as Universal City Studios, despite the fact that on hundreds of Universal films, that's what's listed as the copyright holder.

THIS is why I'm confused. I'm not saying I'm not wrong, not even in the slightest, I just haven't seen anything yet that convinces me what I'm doing is incorrect (the MPAA website doesn't do it for me, I'm not going to go to the MPAA website to figure out every theatrical distributor, I'm going to go to the credits, so I have to know from the credits if what I'm entering is wrong or right).

The film distinctly says twice on the credits that it's Presented/Produced/Released by Twentieth Century Fox (no Film Corporation). That's what I go with.

If I'm supposed to be taking it from the copyright holder, cool, I'll absolutely do that! I got no problem with it what-so-ever. Because that's the only place that Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation shows up, is in the copyright notice (copyright notice during the closing credits and copyright on the back cover).

That's what I've always gone with. That's what I've seen every single contribution ever come through my local go with and never, until today, have I ever seen anyone have an issue with it.

So yeah, I'm confused 
The night is calling. And it whispers to me soflty come and play.
 Last edited: by Merrik
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMerrik
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Registered: September 30, 2008
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And if that is what we're supposed to have been using this whole time, there's a lot of corrections that need to be made  (which is not me being facetious, I'm really saying, that's going to be a lot of profiles that need correcting).
The night is calling. And it whispers to me soflty come and play.
 Last edited: by Merrik
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMerrik
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Also,

If it is supposed to be that, is Corp a suffix or is actually part of the company's name?

Like, I know obviously companies register and get Inc. and Corp. etc. etc as a suffix on their name, but there are actual companies out there that have the word Corporation as part of their company name. Would Corporation actually be part of the Twentieth Century Fox Film Corporation name? Or is it a proper suffix?

I asked this same question about Loews a couple months back (whether or not the suffix attached to Loews was actually a suffix or actually part of its name) and not a single person answered me.

I'm not knowledgeable enough in this area to know.
The night is calling. And it whispers to me soflty come and play.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorrdodolak
Registered: March 18, 2007
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The film ratings web site doesn't have to be solely used, but it can help validate what is listed in the end credits when there are questions as to what is the correct "studio."

Here's a Fox web site link which talks a bit about their divisions.  Notice, as I read it, it mentions Fox Film produces, acquires, and distributes, but the other divisions only produce or acquire.

https://foxcareers.com/OurCompany/Divisions/Film

Quote:
20th Century Fox Film
20th Century Fox Film produces, acquires and distributes motion pictures throughout the world. These motion pictures are produced or acquired by the following divisions:

- Fox 2000 Pictures
- Fox Searchlight Pictures
- Fox International Productions
- Twentieth Century Fox Animation and Blue Sky Studios
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorT!M
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Let's stick with "Twentieth Century Fox", please, and if needed, let's re-word the contribution rules to properly enforce that.

Quoting Merrik:
Quote:
The film distinctly says twice on the credits that it's Presented/Produced/Released by Twentieth Century Fox (no Film Corporation). That's what I go with.

This.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
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Quoting T!M:
Quote:
Let's stick with "Twentieth Century Fox", please, and if needed, let's re-word the contribution rules to properly enforce that.

Quoting Merrik:
Quote:
The film distinctly says twice on the credits that it's Presented/Produced/Released by Twentieth Century Fox (no Film Corporation). That's what I go with.

This.

Agreed.
List of common name threads - Headshots starting point
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Here is what the Rules say:
Quote:
Do not abbreviate Studio or Media Company names. e.g, use Universal Pictures not just Universal; The Criterion Collection rather than Criterion or Criterion Collection; Walt Disney Pictures not just Disney. Exception: If the studio name is too long to fit, use standard abbreviation rules.

Omit company suffixes such as LLC, Ltd., Inc.

I can see why you might want to exclude "Corporation", but given this rule, why do you believe the word "Film" should be excluded?

Please do not abreviate the rules when citing:
Quote:
Some companies (using similar but different names) may serve more than one function. List such companies only once, using the name from the logo. List secondary publishers even if the name is similar. If you are unsure of the function performed, do not list the company.

Do not abbreviate Studio or Media Company names. e.g, use Universal Pictures not just Universal; The Criterion Collection rather than Criterion or Criterion Collection; Walt Disney Pictures not just Disney. Exception: If the studio name is too long to fit, use standard abbreviation rules.

Omit company suffixes such as LLC, Ltd., Inc.

Ignoring the fact, that the whole excerpt is from the media company rules (I'd admit, that this is valid for production studios too), this shows the intention to normalize the studio names... and gives the logo preference over any other source...
List of common name threads - Headshots starting point
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
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Quoting rdodolak:
Quote:
Besides the end credits, the MPAA film ratings site also corroborates the theatrical distributor as Twentieth Century Fox Film Corp.

https://www.filmratings.com/Search?filmTitle=good+son&x=0&y=0

Why shall we use external references, when the movie itself delivers all relevant information? This is a complete new approach.
List of common name threads - Headshots starting point
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMerrik
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Quoting rdodolak:
Quote:
The film ratings web site doesn't have to be solely used, but it can help validate what is listed in the end credits when there are questions as to what is the correct "studio."

Here's a Fox web site link which talks a bit about their divisions.  Notice, as I read it, it mentions Fox Film produces, acquires, and distributes, but the other divisions only produce or acquire.

https://foxcareers.com/OurCompany/Divisions/Film

Quote:
20th Century Fox Film
20th Century Fox Film produces, acquires and distributes motion pictures throughout the world. These motion pictures are produced or acquired by the following divisions:

- Fox 2000 Pictures
- Fox Searchlight Pictures
- Fox International Productions
- Twentieth Century Fox Animation and Blue Sky Studios


Yes of course it can, my apologies if I implied otherwise (which I think I kind of did although I'm not sure I meant to lol). Using online information of course can be of valuable help when contributing.

And I do appreciate that link very much! 

Thanks for providing it. Always trying to be as in the know as possible about stuff to make the contributions I submit as good as possible.


I hope you don't think I'm being purposely obtuse or argumentative, I'm not trying to be...

The credits say, in multiple places, Presented/Produced/Released by Twentieth Century Fox. If someone wasn't to go literally through every single inch of the credits... how would they know that it could possibly be anything else? They'd look at the opening credits, see Twentieth Century Fox and enter that. And that looks like that's what's been happening since, well... as long as I've been here. Like I said, this is the first time I've ever seen it called into question either on someone else's contribution or mine.
The night is calling. And it whispers to me soflty come and play.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributormreeder50
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I'm with T!M on this one.
Marty - Registered July 10, 2004, User since 2002.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
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Quoting mreeder50:
Quote:
I'm with T!M on this one.



same here .
checked my collection - over 300 TCF and less thasn 30 for the other variants (TC-F, TCFFC, TC-FFC, TCFF, TC-FF).
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorrdodolak
Registered: March 18, 2007
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Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
Ignoring the fact, that the whole excerpt is from the media company rules (I'd admit, that this is valid for production studios too), this shows the intention to normalize the studio names... and gives the logo preference over any other source...


What about the theatrical release studio?  Remember we have the theatrical release studio and the production companies which may or may not be from the same parent company.

Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
Why shall we use external references, when the movie itself delivers all relevant information? This is a complete new approach.


You don't have to as it's listed at the end of the film credits, but using external references, it's just that a "reference," isn't a completely new approach.  Just look at the Rating Details section or the Disc-Level profiles section of the contribution rules which mentions:

Quote:
Filmratings.com, or the equivalent region-specific ratings information website

Quote:
If there are no episode synopses available in the release, you may add a brief self-written synopses, or one from the official website.
 Last edited: by rdodolak
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