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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3  Previous   Next
Cast in old profiles
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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I'm on a mission! 

I am going through a lot of my oldest DVDs, doing audits on them and contributing those that need it.

I have one problem, though. A lot of those profiles have undocumented cast roles where there are no roles given in the credits. If the cast is otherwise correct, I tend to leave the roles as is, but if I have to make any changes to the cast I clear out all roles. I could research the role names, but I spend half an hour or more on each profile as it is (more if I need to make new scans and tweak them).

My reasoning is that the undocumented roles wouldn't be accepted today in a new contribution, so it would be wrong for me to contribute undocumented roles as part of my contribution. But if I don't have to touch the cast, then I feel OK letting it slide.

Do you think that I'm doing the right thing?
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
Profiling since 2004
Registered: May 19, 2007
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As long as the role names were already in the profile before the amendment, I'd accept them without any further documentation (it should be sufficient documentation, that someone documented it sometimes) - and I'd prefer keeping them instead removing them in doubt.

... keep in mind, that there will never be the one and only role name set, if the roles are not listed with the credits. From my point of view it is better to have any of them in, instead of removing them all together.
Complete list of Common Names  •  A good point for starting with Headshots
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributoriPatsa
Aficionado since 1999
Registered: March 13, 2007
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If the profiles are very old you would have to check out the old Intervocative site as well to know if they are really "undocumented" as you put it.
Patrik
 Last edited: by iPatsa
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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Re Intervocative:
If Ken thought that the contribution notes from the old site had any value, he should have ported them over to Invelos. He did not. I don't even know if it is possible to access the old contribution notes. If it is, I certainly don't know how. As far as I am concerned, if the data is not in the current notes, then it is undocumented.

When you contribute, you contribute whole sections. If you add a subtitle, then you contribute all checked subtitles, and you should make sure that all checked subtitles actually exists on the disc. If you change or add an audio track, you should make sure that all audio tracks are correct. If you change or add something in the cast section, you should make sure that the whole section is correct. Or at least that's the way I see it.

If I contribute cast, then I am (morally) responsible to make sure to the best of my abilities that the roles entered are correct. For all I know they could be wildly incorrect.

For me, the alternative would be to not contribute the cast section at all, even if I find that the cast names (not the role names) do not match the credits. If I don't touch it, then it's not my responsability. But is it a better choice?
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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First, I would say watch the film.  If that's not feasible then I would check the Intervocative site for notes.  If those don't help, I would check the roles against a few sites (e.g. IMDB, AFI, The Movie DB, Wikipedia, etc.) and if there is agreement, leave those roles intact.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorT!M
User since 6 Dec. 2000
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Summarizing: there doesn't seem to be much enthusiasm for wholesale removal… Not from me, either. If an existing profile has role names, I would either leave them, or, if I had the time, I would try to verify and/or improve them by using the methods outlined by others (watching the disc, looking for old notes, online research) - but I wouldn't just strip 'em away.
 Last edited: by T!M
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
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Ken weighed in on the removal of Uncredited Cast here:

http://invelos.com/Forums.aspx?task=viewtopic&topicID=430575&PageNum=1
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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I selected those profiles in my collection that were missing disc id. The idea was that if that is missing, then it's a good chance that other data is missing also. It's a list of several hundred profiles, so I started with the oldest ones. So far I have contributed 69 profiles in the last 30 days.

Watching the films is - obviously - not an option. Like I said, I could research the role names, but I'm already spending up to an hour per profile, so I'm not prepared to do that.
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
Ken weighed in on the removal of Uncredited Cast here:

http://invelos.com/Forums.aspx?task=viewtopic&topicID=430575&PageNum=1

This thread does not concern uncredited cast. It concerns undocumented role names, which is something entirely different.
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMithi
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Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting GSyren:
Quote:
I don't even know if it is possible to access the old contribution notes.

They are accessible, e.g.
  • new: http://www.invelos.com/Forums.aspx?task=contributionnotes&type=DVD&ProfileUPC=025192018626

  • old: http://legacy.intervocative.com/Forums.aspx?task=contributionnotes&type=DVD&ProfileUPC=2519201862

  • First and last digits of the ID are omitted in the old-style for 12 digit UPCs

    or
  • new: http://www.invelos.com/Forums.aspx?task=contributionnotes&type=DVD&ProfileUPC=4030521290778.5

  • old: http://legacy.intervocative.com/Forums.aspx?task=contributionnotes&type=DVD&ProfileUPC=030521290778.5

  • First digit is omitted in 13 digit EANs
    Mithi's little XSLT tinkering - the power of XML
    DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
    Profiling since 2001
    Registered: March 14, 2007
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    Sweden Posts: 3,384
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    Well, like I said, as far as I'm concerned, if it isn't in the current notes, it's undocumented. So there are only two options from me under the described circumstances
    - correct cast with no roles
    - unchanged incorrect cast with roles intact

    If the former is against the rules, or if there is a majority against it, then you'll be stuck with the latter. With the former, anyone who so wishes can do the research and complete the profile. Finding out which profiles are left with incorrect cast will be a lot harder. So let me know which is better.
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    Gunnar
    DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributoriPatsa
    Aficionado since 1999
    Registered: March 13, 2007
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    Quoting GSyren:
    Quote:
    Re Intervocative:
    If Ken thought that the contribution notes from the old site had any value, he should have ported them over to Invelos. He did not. I don't even know if it is possible to access the old contribution notes. If it is, I certainly don't know how. As far as I am concerned, if the data is not in the current notes, then it is undocumented.


    You presume to know what Ken think. I do not. I'm just pointing out that before you remove any "undocumented" roles you should at least check the old notes (if any exist) before you assume that they have no value.

    Me personally, I'm fine with no role names, since that is how the film credits look. Usually we enter everything as credited so I see nothing wrong with leaving them out in a new profile. But removing them carte blanche from all legacy profiles doesn't sound like a good strategy.
    Patrik
     Last edited: by iPatsa
    DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantzappman
    Registered: September 6, 2008
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    My personal preference is to keep the roles intact.
    DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
    Profiling since 2001
    Registered: March 14, 2007
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    The whole thing is really quite simple. When I do these audits now, for my local database I always remove roles if the credits don't have  them and they are not documented in the current contribution notes. Always. For my local. I do not research. I may or may not research roles at a later date, but I will not now.

    If there were no changes to the cast, then I do not contribute cast, leaving it with roles in the online.

    If there were changes to the cast I can either contribute the corrected cast (w/o roles), or I can refrain from contributing the cast (leaving the uncorrected cast plus roles in the online).

    Those are the only two options. I just want to know which one you think is better.
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    Gunnar
    DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
    Registered: March 20, 2007
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    Quoting GSyren:
    Quote:
    If there were changes to the cast I can either contribute the corrected cast (w/o roles), or I can refrain from contributing the cast (leaving the uncorrected cast plus roles in the online).

    Those are the only two options. I just want to know which one you think is better.

    I vote for option two.  It makes your life easier and no one will ever complain about it.

    ---------------
    DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
    Profiling since 2001
    Registered: March 14, 2007
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    Quoting scotthm:
    Quote:

    I vote for option two.  It makes your life easier and no one will ever complain about it.

    Yeah, there's that. I was thinking more in terms of which is best for the online database, but you do have a good point.
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    Gunnar
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