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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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I will stop contributing to this database |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 1,242 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Phil the Mill: Quote:
My last point is about updating profiles and the voting system. Who is really happy about that, I ‘am not. Look for instance at “8-714865-556160 The Godfather: DVD-collection” after the update the complete list of cast and crew, overview, features, subtitles and so on is wiped out. Who did approve these changes, this doesn’t work very well this way.
This database must be more easy to access for contributing. At this moment I do have the feeling that it is easier for me to become a member of the “International Olympic Committee” than to upload a contribution to the DVD profiler.
Btw. I like the DVD Profiler 3.0 software very much and I think Ken is doing a very good job in general. I only want to help developing it to a better accessibility because that’s in my opinion the key for success. Because a program like this must have al large (worldwide) community to be successful. Well Phil I did go and look at your suggestion of Profile 8-714865-556160 The Godfather: DVD-collection. and I would suggest to you that you go and read the rules http://www.invelos.com/dvdpro/contributions/Rules.aspx?display=boxsets this page in particular, whereby it clearly states that a BOX SET must not contain any of the pieces of information you are insisting on being there. The information you are on about with this profile belongs as you are told on the BOX SET RULE page in the CHILD PROFILES. Seems funny how users have been using the program for quite a long time without too much trouble and without complaining about not being allowed to use IMDb. And before you spout on about me being another Yank I'm not I'm English through and through, but I also follow the rules for contributing. If I don't like the way the rules say to do one particular section I either don't submit that bit...or submit in the permitted way then chage my local database and lock it. Steve |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 5,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Just as with Surfeur, you are applying YOUR version of correct. There is NO correct, just as there is seldom a real truth. I could say it is raining, and you could say it is not and BOTH comments could be correct, because of our relative view of the environment in which we reside...unless you happened to be my neighbor.  For the purposes of the Online database as I have explained CORRECT is relative to the Case and the Disc/Film, any other CORRECT is a personal matter and does not belong in the Online database. Invelos's Online database is not designed to be a reference source, it is designed to be a starting point from which ALL users can take the base data and then customize it to suit their particular needs. IMDb is built as reference and as such it is a miserable failure, it is one of the worst and most inaccurate, unreliable sources of information I have ever seen, they do not even present their data in any kind of consistent form. If you start allowing what you propose, then it is just a half step to you making similar canges to the Online cast and crew data as well, claiming that there are tpos and mistakes in the filmed data, and then we will look like IMDb and be just as inaccurate. All you have to do is recognize what the function of the Online is versus your local database. We are ALWAYS going to have users just like you who want to do it differently.
Phil, you are a recent memeber you don't know the history here. You weren't here before we had Rules and the database was a total wreck. We had users like you trying to even pervert the database by trying to manipulate the sorting of films BECAUSE they wanted have all the James Bond titles together. So they were setting up James Bond 04, or 004 or whatever instead of Thunderball, we had profiles which bounced all over the place on a weekly basis as usersengaged in Contribution wars to manipulate the database. Those days are over, we have a standard for the Online that is based on the disc and the case, and you are free to do whatever you wish locally to have your particular database perform the way YOU want it to perform.
Skip Way out of line, with both my original idea and his speculation. I do not want to destroy the database's accuracy in nailing down exactly as shown. My new field could contain suggestions which could be viewed by owners of the software... users, without changing any of the current fields. This would help guide us in "fixing" our local databeses only. It could contain disagreements. We change nothing that is not exactly as on the disc or the cover in the database -- but add perhaps a downloadable "notes"-type field... In which submitters would add "Nicole de Boer is also Nicole deBoer and Nikki de Boer" or "'referee's' ought to be 'referees' in the overview, as it is a plural, not a possessive". Just hints as to what might be considered corrections to local databases. | | | If it wasn't for bad taste, I wouldn't have no taste at all.
Cliff | | | | Last edited: by VibroCount |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,694 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting VibroCount:
Quote:
I agree that the rules need to be followed. But by doing so, we occasionally enter known errors: misspelled words and names, illogical grammer and punctuation... and just some strange stuff.
It might be nice (and I have no idea how this might be accomplished, sorry) if there was a way, perhaps a separate field, where a submitter (original or updating one) could enter known errors ...
People say they enter mistakes to avoid ping pong.
Why not use the vote system? If there is a spelling mistake in a overview, the first contributor corrects it. If someone wants to put back the mistake, votes will decide.
What we have now are people contributing the mistake, and if somebody wants to correct it, he gets no votes.
Sorry, but this ultra strict application of the rules is MAD. You just don't get it, do ya? First, this is DVD Profiler, not Movie Profiler. That's why the rules say the primary source is the DVD. Second, we enter things exactly as they are as much as possible to avoid ping ponging profiles. Third, as you have already been told at least a dozen times, the online database is the source for ALL users, so if you want it different in your local do it that way, and then don't contribute. Do you need a 2x4 to hit between the ears to get your attention, or is this sufficient? | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964
Make America Great Again! |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 951 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting beldvd: Quote:
Quoting Tracer:
Quote:
Quoting beldvd:
Quote:
I think that verifying current data would be more useful (for example, multiple entries for same actor, but different spelling: e.a Nicole de Boer, making it impossible to cross-reference...). Current actor DB is a complete mess IMHO...
The DB would not be such a mess if users had been following the rules all along by taking the names from the film credits. But, we instead had contributors doing what they wanted and others following the rules. Thus the mess... Everyone contributing to the online DB needs to be working off the same set of rules. I'm not judging you on your decision not to contribute, that's your decision to make.
I don't agree, Nicole deBoer is credited on DS9 but Nicole de Boer is credited on Dead Zone, thus the double entry...
I'm sorry, but beyond a reasonnable doubt, there are the same actress... Then make a common name contribution, that's what that feature is there for. However you must first understand what the common name should be. Because it only links DVD Profiler profiles it should be her most commonly credited as name, not a birth name or the name she may call herself personally. So you will need to do some research and determine which name she goes by most often in her credits. | | | Are you local?
This is a local shop the strangers you would bring would not understand us, our customs, our local ways. |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 1,029 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting VibroCount: Quote:
It might be nice (and I have no idea how this might be accomplished, sorry) if there was a way, perhaps a separate field, where a submitter (original or updating one) could enter known errors in the information. (So-and-so's name misspelled in the cast list, etc.) This way we each could see the thoughts from submitters and users and could choose to update the profile locally or not. You mean something like the Contribution Notes? Quoting Mark Harrison: Quote:
I do believe the rule was designed well before we had a voting system. I'm not saying the rule should be abolished because of the voting system, but I certainly think it's worth taking another look at it. I'm not convinced that the restriction on correcting spelling mistakes makes sense at this point. Like you, I believe some of the rules we have today are completely insane.
With that said, I seriously doubt you'll gain enough support to ever change this. But it's worth a shot. Well, you could start a poll, and I would vote Yes, but that is all the "support" I'm willing to provide. I don't have the time and especially not the James-like  patience to do more. Maybe if Ken would show an active interest in these areas (after all, it is his database), I could bring myself to care about it again. | | | | Matthias | | | | Last edited: by goodguy |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 3,433 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Mark Harrison: Quote:
I do believe the rule was designed well before we had a voting system. I looked it up, as I got curious... The Rules came on June 30, 2005 but the voting was already implemented on February 14, 2005! | | | Achim [諾亞信； Ya-Shin//Nuo], a German in Taiwan.
Registered: May 29, 2000 (at InterVocative) |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | I was waiting for that.  Thank you, Achim. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 3,321 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting ya_shin: Quote:
The Rules came on June 30, 2005 but the voting was already implemented on February 14, 2005! That might be when the rules were released (I'm not sure). But that doesn't mean the rule was written after we had voting. And I stand by my statement that it's a stupid rule and not necessary with the current voting system. | | | Get the CSVExport and Database Query plug-ins here.
Create fake parent profiles to organize your collection. |
|   | Berak | | Bibamus morieundum est! |
| Registered: May 10, 2007 |  Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | What's with all this - "it's a stupid rule" "I don't want to contribute anymore because I have to state my sources" - cowpie?!!! Either stick to the rules, join the Rules Commitee and make your case, or butt out (without whining about it in these forums!  | | | Berak
It's better to burn out than to fade away!
True love conquers all! | | | | Last edited: by Berak |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 17,329 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Berak: Quote:
Either stick to the rules, join the Rules Commitee and make your case, or butt out (without whining about it in these forums! Simple... Direct and to the point... I agree 100% | | | | Pete |
|  | Dan W | | Registered: May 9, 2002 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 980 |
| | | Berak | | Bibamus morieundum est! |
| Registered: May 10, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | Berak
It's better to burn out than to fade away!
True love conquers all! |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,372 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Berak: Quote:
What's with all this -
"it's a stupid rule"
"I don't want to contribute anymore because I have to state my sources" -
cowpie?!!!
Either stick to the rules, join the Rules Commitee and make your case, or butt out (without whining about it in these forums! Sorry Mark - I know you can speak for yourself but... If you are referring to Mark's "stupid rule" comment I can assure you he has always followed the rules no matter how "stupid" or incorrect he thinks they might be. He has also been involved in every rule writing process including being the one who completely set up the last forum to discuss them (the version that never was  but that's another issue). He has spent well into the hundreds of hours dealing with the rules for over two years as compared to your 3 posts in the rules committee forum. So before you go calling his opinion "bull$hit" at least know the facts. Brutal perhaps but far from correct. Although brutal is what these forums are all about any more. every freggin day I find it harder and harder to come here... | | | | Last edited: by lyonsden5 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Rick: In the most polite form I can apply, you have certainly brought your share of brutality, as we all have. And i have repeatedly called for a change. Ready when you are Gridley. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Berak | | Bibamus morieundum est! |
| Registered: May 10, 2007 | | Posts: 1,059 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting lyonsden5: Quote:
Quoting Berak:
Quote:
What's with all this -
"it's a stupid rule"
"I don't want to contribute anymore because I have to state my sources" -
cowpie?!!!
Either stick to the rules, join the Rules Commitee and make your case, or butt out (without whining about it in these forums!
Sorry Mark - I know you can speak for yourself but...
If you are referring to Mark's "stupid rule" comment I can assure you he has always followed the rules no matter how "stupid" or incorrect he thinks they might be.
He has also been involved in every rule writing process including being the one who completely set up the last forum to discuss them (the version that never was but that's another issue). He has spent well into the hundreds of hours dealing with the rules for over two years as compared to your 3 posts in the rules committee forum. So before you go calling his opinion "bull$hit" at least know the facts.
Brutal perhaps but far from correct.
Although brutal is what these forums are all about any more.
every freggin day I find it harder and harder to come here... Did you take it personal?!  You really should let Mark - or whoever - speak for themselves... I didn't mention any specific entries, I merely stated my opinion regarding the consistent WHINING in these forums about "I want this, and I want that".... If you don't like my opinion - fine, but don't give me any hassle for telling people to take it to the correct forums. As to your reference regarding my entries in the rules commitee forum (I will give my opinion when I have one)... I am quite happy with the way things are - need I say more?!....  | | | Berak
It's better to burn out than to fade away!
True love conquers all! | | | | Last edited: by Berak |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,321 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Berak: Quote:
You really should let Mark - or whoever - speak for themselves...
Just so we're clear, I grant Rick complete authority to speak for me. Thanks Rick! Quote:
I didn't mention any specific entries, I merely stated my opinion regarding the consistent WHINING in these forums about "I want this, and I want that".... So it's now WHINING to state what it is you want?  There was no whining on my part. I stated that I thought the rule no longer made sense. I think I also referred to it as "stupid". In fact I specifically stated that the rule shouldn't be thrown out. I said that it might be time to revisit it. See, here's how it works. I threw that out there to see the responses. Maybe there's no interest in changing the rule and maybe there is. You don't know until you discuss the possibility. Or "whine" about it if you prefer that terminology. But the most important part is to get the input of everyone. If there is an interest, then it should be moved to the contribution rules area for further discussion. Depending on how that goes, you should next try to come up with a new rule, get people to agree on it, then hand it over to Ken for review. Quote:
If you don't like my opinion - fine, I don't really care about your opinion. It's your attitude I have the problem with. That makes your opinion completely irrelevant. Quote:
but don't give me any hassle for telling people to take it to the correct forums. I have no interest in hassling you at all. I plan to completely ignore you. | | | Get the CSVExport and Database Query plug-ins here.
Create fake parent profiles to organize your collection. | | | | Last edited: by Mark Harrison |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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