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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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| Registered: March 20, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 2,851 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
Nope! The database belongs to Invelos, so it's definitely their rules. Exactly. You contribute, voters vote, and the Invelos screeners decide. Simple. No polls or long threads necessary. --------------- |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 5,715 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
Quoting JMGuer:
Quote:
What should is what the DVDP online users want to call it.
And how would you determine what (the majority of) the DVDP online users want? Most of them don't even come here. As in any democratical system only the one using their vote build a majority. Means, posting here and voting on contributions qualifies for being a DVDP online user... | | | | Complete list of Common Names • A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1) |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 4,684 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting AiAustria: Quote:
As in any democratical system only the one using their vote build a majority. Means, posting here and voting on contributions qualifies for being a DVDP online user... Well, it's hardly a democracy unless you inform people up front about it. What you're advocating sounds more like something like meritocracy, or some other -cracy ... | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Huge red herring. We used to get the title from the film credits which, unless I am mistaken, has always shown the title of the film. Now we get the title from the front of the case which, unless I am mistaken, is cluttered with all kinds of text that we have to pluck the title from so, no, we haven't been doing it the same way for 18 years. I wasn't talking about the process, I was talking about the result. Regardless of which process you apply over the past 18 years, the result was the same for these releases (not all). Neither "The Criterion Collection" nor "Midnite Movies" were ever part of the DVD title. Why after 18 years would we suddenly think the result should be different? That's what I take issue with. | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,715 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
As in any democratical system only the one using their vote build a majority. Means, posting here and voting on contributions qualifies for being a DVDP online user...
Well, it's hardly a democracy unless you inform people up front about it. What you're advocating sounds more like something like meritocracy, or some other -cracy ... ... only if the merits are the loudest (virtual) voice and the ability to ignore any other opinion  No, seriously, I see your point, but none the less, concerning the building of the rules and populating the data base, we work just like a democracy, with all its benefits and drawbacks... As in real life, not everyone is pleased with the outcome, or is actively involved at all. But signing up to this software seems to be a more active step than only reaching a definied point of adolescence - means a birth day - to be part of it... Although all the fighting and argueing is a little bit annoying sometimes, there is a visible progress here: we improve the database from day to day, most of the guys not able to understand rules - or even the need of them - keep their stuff locally and - last not least - even the tone around here has gotten softer over the years - that's why I came back this year after a very long passive phase... p.s. The -isms speech of Ferris Bueller were funnier than any -crazies  | | | | Complete list of Common Names • A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1) | | | | Last edited: by AiAustria |
| | Registered: December 27, 2009 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,131 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Huge red herring. We used to get the title from the film credits which, unless I am mistaken, has always shown the title of the film. Now we get the title from the front of the case which, unless I am mistaken, is cluttered with all kinds of text that we have to pluck the title from so, no, we haven't been doing it the same way for 18 years.
I wasn't talking about the process, I was talking about the result. Regardless of which process you apply over the past 18 years, the result was the same for these releases (not all). Neither "The Criterion Collection" nor "Midnite Movies" were ever part of the DVD title. Why after 18 years would we suddenly think the result should be different? That's what I take issue with. Problem with your logic is that they have been part of the DVD title for 18 years. You've just ignored it. Or it was easier to just put the content titles in it's place. And when in doubt, put it in the edition field. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting ateo357: Quote:
Problem with your logic is that they have been part of the DVD title for 18 years. You've just ignored it. Or it was easier to just put the content titles in it's place. And when in doubt, put it in the edition field. The problem with your logic is that for 18 years the titles (and editions) were entered according to the Rules that Ken gave us. I didn't ignore anything. | | | | Hal |
| | Registered: December 27, 2009 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,131 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
Quoting ateo357:
Quote:
Problem with your logic is that they have been part of the DVD title for 18 years. You've just ignored it. Or it was easier to just put the content titles in it's place. And when in doubt, put it in the edition field.
The problem with your logic is that for 18 years the titles (and editions) were entered according to the Rules that Ken gave us. I didn't ignore anything. Title -The title for a Box Set should be the title listed on the front cover, for example Alien Quadrilogy since Ken rarely chimes into any forum discussion and the screeners seem to accept most contributions, you assumed that you were doing it correctly. So now you have a DVD database that you can't search for specialized series or line of films on DVD i.e. Dragon Dynasty, Midnite Movies, The Crierion Collection, Classic Monster Collection, Toho Master Collection etc. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
I wasn't talking about the process, I was talking about the result. Regardless of which process you apply over the past 18 years, the result was the same for these releases (not all). Neither "The Criterion Collection" nor "Midnite Movies" were ever part of the DVD title. Why after 18 years would we suddenly think the result should be different? That's what I take issue with. We don't think, suddenly, after 18 years, the results should be different. I think, the minute the rule was changed, that the result should have been different. When the rule was changed, 'Bad Santa' became 'Badder Santa'. When the rule was changed, 'There's Something About Mary' became 'There's Something More About Mary'. When the rule was changed, the titles in question didn't change. Not because they shouldn't have, but because people didn't like the resulting title. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: December 27, 2009 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,131 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
I wasn't talking about the process, I was talking about the result. Regardless of which process you apply over the past 18 years, the result was the same for these releases (not all). Neither "The Criterion Collection" nor "Midnite Movies" were ever part of the DVD title. Why after 18 years would we suddenly think the result should be different? That's what I take issue with.
We don't think, suddenly, after 18 years, the results should be different. I think, the minute the rule was changed, that the result should have been different.
When the rule was changed, 'Bad Santa' became 'Badder Santa'.
When the rule was changed, 'There's Something About Mary' became 'There's Something More About Mary'.
When the rule was changed, the titles in question didn't change. Not because they shouldn't have, but because people didn't like the resulting title. and that is the problem. I've ran into the same results with CSI episode numbers from disc drop down menus. People didn't like the change , so they voted no. | | | | Last edited: by ateo357 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
I wasn't talking about the process, I was talking about the result. Regardless of which process you apply over the past 18 years, the result was the same for these releases (not all). Neither "The Criterion Collection" nor "Midnite Movies" were ever part of the DVD title. Why after 18 years would we suddenly think the result should be different? That's what I take issue with.
We don't think, suddenly, after 18 years, the results should be different. I think, the minute the rule was changed, that the result should have been different.
When the rule was changed, 'Bad Santa' became 'Badder Santa'.
When the rule was changed, 'There's Something About Mary' became 'There's Something More About Mary'.
When the rule was changed, the titles in question didn't change. Not because they shouldn't have, but because people didn't like the resulting title. I disagree. They weren't changed because people recognized quite readily that "The Criterion Collection" and "Midnite Movies" were editions, not part of the title, especially since "The Criterion Collection" was included as an example of an Edition in the Rules. Just out of curiosity, how many these titles did you contribute at the time the rules changed to "fix" the titles. I have many Criterion titles, and I don't remember anyone trying to add "The Criterion Collection" to the title back then. Now years later, suddenly, they're wrong? | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
I disagree. They weren't changed because people recognized quite readily that "The Criterion Collection" and "Midnite Movies" were editions, not part of the title, especially since "The Criterion Collection" was included as an example of an Edition in the Rules. I don't know why you're throwing in 'The Criterion Collection' as we already established that I don't believe it to be an edition at all. However, since you did bring it up, from the Criterion website: "Since 1984, the Criterion Collection, a continuing series of important classic and contemporary films..." So, if they consider them to be a 'continuing series', why don't we? Oh, I know, because they have the word 'collection in their name. Not to mention, if we did admit that they were a series of releases, we would have to enter the title using that rule. As for what people recognized quite readily, how is that any different than my saying they didn't like the resulting title? At the core of both statements is the unmistakable fact that it was based 100% on personal choice. Quote:
Just out of curiosity, how many these titles did you contribute at the time the rules changed to "fix" the titles. I have many Criterion titles, and I don't remember anyone trying to add "The Criterion Collection" to the title back then. Now years later, suddenly, they're wrong? Really? This has already been answered but I will do so again since you seemed to have missed it. How many did I contribute? Well, as I said earlier, I don't own any of them...which is why I don't really care whether or not they get changed. Unlike other users, I don't contribute or change titles I do not own. Suddenly, years later, they're wrong? No, as I said earlier, in my opinion, they were wrong the minute the rule was changed but, as far as I am concerned, that really doesn't matter. You believe they are correct, as is, so you will never believe they are wrong. ateo believes they are wrong and, unless I am misreading him, will never believe they are correct under the current rule. How long they have been done this way is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: December 27, 2009 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,131 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
I disagree. They weren't changed because people recognized quite readily that "The Criterion Collection" and "Midnite Movies" were editions, not part of the title, especially since "The Criterion Collection" was included as an example of an Edition in the Rules.
I don't know why you're throwing in 'The Criterion Collection' as we already established that I don't believe it to be an edition at all. However, since you did bring it up, from the Criterion website:
"Since 1984, the Criterion Collection, a continuing series of important classic and contemporary films..."
So, if they consider them to be a 'continuing series', why don't we? Oh, I know, because they have the word 'collection in their name. Not to mention, if we did admit that they were a series of releases, we would have to enter the title using that rule.
As for what people recognized quite readily, how is that any different than my saying they didn't like the resulting title? At the core of both statements is the unmistakable fact that it was based 100% on personal choice.
Quote:
Just out of curiosity, how many these titles did you contribute at the time the rules changed to "fix" the titles. I have many Criterion titles, and I don't remember anyone trying to add "The Criterion Collection" to the title back then. Now years later, suddenly, they're wrong?
Really? This has already been answered but I will do so again since you seemed to have missed it.
How many did I contribute? Well, as I said earlier, I don't own any of them...which is why I don't really care whether or not they get changed. Unlike other users, I don't contribute or change titles I do not own.
Suddenly, years later, they're wrong? No, as I said earlier, in my opinion, they were wrong the minute the rule was changed but, as far as I am concerned, that really doesn't matter. You believe they are correct, as is, so you will never believe they are wrong. ateo believes they are wrong and, unless I am misreading him, will never believe they are correct under the current rule. How long they have been done this way is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I don't know what the rule was before I bought the progam, but as the rules stand now I don't think alot of DVD titles are entered the way they should be for a collectors program and database. There clearly wasn't a true collector in the rules committee. Just people who owned a bunch of DVD's. If there was a true collector, special lines and collection groups would have been the 1st priority. Shouldn't have to go elsewhere to find a complete list of TWC's Dragon Dynasty line or the complete Criterion line or any of the other series that I listed earlier. |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,684 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting ateo357: Quote:
I don't know what the rule was before I bought the progam, but as the rules stand now I don't think alot of DVD titles are entered the way they should be for a collectors program and database. There clearly wasn't a true collector in the rules committee. Just people who owned a bunch of DVD's. If there was a true collector, special lines and collection groups would have been the 1st priority. Shouldn't have to go elsewhere to find a complete list of TWC's Dragon Dynasty line or the complete Criterion line or any of the other series that I listed earlier. Well, I guess that depends on what kind of collector you are. Or perhaps I should say what you are collecting. Personally, I collect movies. DVD (or BD) just happens to be the medium of choice. For me, trying to get a complete collection of, say, Dragon Dynasty titles, without caring about the actual movies, would make no sense whatever. Trying to get a complete collection of movies with Christopher Lee would make more sense, however I would still hesitate to buy movies that I know I wouldn't like. If your definition of a "true collector" means someone who collects objects for the sake of collecting, and not for enjoying their actual content, then I think that you are right in that the rules were not created by true collectors. And I don't think that DVD Profiler is, or ever was, aimed primarily at that kind of true collectors. | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
| | Registered: December 27, 2009 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,131 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote:
Quoting ateo357:
Quote:
I don't know what the rule was before I bought the progam, but as the rules stand now I don't think alot of DVD titles are entered the way they should be for a collectors program and database. There clearly wasn't a true collector in the rules committee. Just people who owned a bunch of DVD's. If there was a true collector, special lines and collection groups would have been the 1st priority. Shouldn't have to go elsewhere to find a complete list of TWC's Dragon Dynasty line or the complete Criterion line or any of the other series that I listed earlier.
Well, I guess that depends on what kind of collector you are. Or perhaps I should say what you are collecting.
Personally, I collect movies. DVD (or BD) just happens to be the medium of choice. For me, trying to get a complete collection of, say, Dragon Dynasty titles, without caring about the actual movies, would make no sense whatever. Trying to get a complete collection of movies with Christopher Lee would make more sense, however I would still hesitate to buy movies that I know I wouldn't like.
If your definition of a "true collector" means someone who collects objects for the sake of collecting, and not for enjoying their actual content, then I think that you are right in that the rules were not created by true collectors. And I don't think that DVD Profiler is, or ever was, aimed primarily at that kind of true collectors. Price - Lee Horror Collection All Regions Released: 1/8/2008 Widescreen 1.33:1 The Christopher Lee Collection All Regions Released: 9/1/2015 Widescreen 1.66:1 according to the rules: these are wrong because they contain the word Collection, that makes them editions. but this is acceptable 4 Film Favorites: Clint Eastwood Comedy: Space Cowboys/Honkytonk Man/Every Which Way/Any Which Way Region 1 Released: 10/14/2008 Anamorphic |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,684 |
| | Posted: | | | | OK, I have two comments, ateo:
I don't quite understand how this relates to what I wrote. I only meant to point out the difference, in my view, of what you seemed to call "true collector" and someone who is just interested in movies. That's not to say that Profiler is any better at identifying all Lee movies (in the online database) than it is at identifying all Dragon Dynasty titles.
But then I am also confused about your claim "according to the rules: these are wrong because they contain the word Collection, that makes them editions." There is nothing in the rules, as far as I can see, that says that a title cannot contain the word "Collection". | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users.
Gunnar |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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