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Quoting DoubleDownAgain:

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Wow.  It's glad to see Ken voted! 

Now it's Ken, Geri, and Forum Moderator 


Quoting surfeur51:

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For contributions, the problem is not Ken's support, it is inappropriate rules  (that, BTW, were mainly suggested by users  ). Rules must be totally rewritten to have usable data in the online database.

I agree, as I assume most of us would, that fixing the rules would be a massive help. So let's get it done! .... oh wait, we need Ken for that to happen... soooo..... yea. Ken has to be involved if anything is going to change for the better no matter what angle you look at it from. Besides, we have been shouting about the need for clearer rules since I joined back in 2008 with no change, only a few additional instructions added when new fields have been added to the database. Updating all of the rules will not be an easy task.

When something is broken, it needs to be repaired rather then left to the users to continuously patch things up.


I'll use the analogy of a street traffic light.

When a light it broken, drivers (you and me) have to work together to keep things moving, but this is a slow process and while there are times when things will run smoothly, it can fail at any time resulting in road rage and/or halted traffic (10-page-long discussions on if a symbol looks like a dash, a hyphen, or a dot). When it is a collection of traffic lights (a.k.a. "the rules") it makes things much harder for us, the drivers, to maintain a steady flow on our own. What we need is for someone to repair the lights, which only Ken can do. But until then, we at least need some traffic cops in charge to help control the traffic and keep it moving smoothly. This job could be done by someone appointed by Ken (which means Ken still has to get involved for a little while) to work as an overseer, but whoever that is would need to stay dedicated to doing the job and remain consistent in final decisions. Members would also have to accept that person's word (just as we would Ken's) as the final say, even if we do not fully agree.

Since Ken has more or less left us to our own devices when it comes to contributions and understanding the rules, we could always be bold and select one or two members ourselves to be the traffic cops (more than one means they can collaborate via PM,) but said person(s) would have to be unbiased, work regularly, and remain consistent, even going to far as to reshape the rules in a consistent way which could decrease the need for help in the first place. The community would also need to be willing to accept that the chosen member(s) have the final say because (s)he was appointed to do so, even if we do not always agree.


So, show if hands, who wants the 24/7/365 job of dealing with us cranky members who can't even agree whether Ken is doing a good job or not? *lowers own hand*

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How so you see who's voted how?

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Quoting ateo357:

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Anyone in their right mind wouldn't vote any higher than 5.

Why?  Some people don't need their hand held all the time.

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But just because I know my way around the supermarket doesn't mean that I don't see the personnel ignore the old lady who can't reach the top shelf.

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And to stay in the supermarket picture:
There once was an employee to help the old ladies, he got fired after the shift because some customer complained that the shelves weren't filled up and the cash-queues were too long.

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Quoting ateo357:

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And that is because the owner thinks that helping the customer and stocking shelves is below him. Plus he knows he is the only supermarket in town and there is no place else to shop. So the customers will keep coming back because they have no other choice.

Following an epiphany that the online database is Ken's and not our personal property we can begin the healing process of letting go and stop worrying so much about its specific content.

It amazes me the number of contributors who seem to believe that the online database should reflect what they've chosen to do locally.  The database is Ken's, and if he doesn't care about it enough to step in here and clarify things then for the life of me I can't imagine why it should be of such importance to contributors, who after all already have the information in their local database.

Ken has already set up a method to determine what will get in the online database, without any need of arguing in the forums or intervention by Ken--it's the contribution/voting/screening process.  If we all contribute what we believe is per the rules, and the voters all vote according to their understanding of the rules, then Ken and his screeners can decide what will be in Invelos' database.  There is little need for Ken to visit and referee our discussions.

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