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Group Divider Question
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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributormreeder50
I was outta bullets
Registered: March 29, 2007
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United States Posts: 2,750
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The movie The Fighting Kentuckian, UPC 017153100280, does not have any closing credits or roles.

The rule reads: "Cast", "In order of appearance" or other similar headers at the start of the credits should not be entered.

The question is how about cast dividers like "Co-starring", "Featuring", "And" or other similar dividers which appear within the credits?

Me and another user have been having a discussion about this and he suggested I put it to the community.
Marty - Registered July 10, 2004, User since 2002.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributormreeder50
I was outta bullets
Registered: March 29, 2007
Reputation: Superior Rating
United States Posts: 2,750
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My contribution was declined, so I assume it was for this reason, so I won't use them. Let's keep this going just to see how the community feels.
Marty - Registered July 10, 2004, User since 2002.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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As long as Invelos continues to approve the use of group dividers for song titles with only one credited writer, I believe this feature is meant to be interpreted with the widest possible discretion.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorNexus the Sixth
Contributor since 2002
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Don't forget the empty divider to mark a gap in the credits. 
First registered: February 15, 2002
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,202
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Quoting mreeder50:
Quote:
The movie The Fighting Kentuckian, UPC 017153100280, does not have any closing credits or roles.

The rule reads: "Cast", "In order of appearance" or other similar headers at the start of the credits should not be entered.

The question is how about cast dividers like "Co-starring", "Featuring", "And" or other similar dividers which appear within the credits?

Me and another user have been having a discussion about this and he suggested I put it to the community.

I have contributed these, in the past, without any issues...the dividers comply with the rules 100% so they shouldn't have been declined.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
Sweden Posts: 4,684
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Quoting the rules:
Quote:
Dividers allow the segregation of cast and crew into logical groupings.
...
"Cast", "In order of appearance" or other similar headers at the start of the credits should not be entered.


In my opinion, "Co-starring" etc does not segregate cast into logical groupings. Also, while the second rule does say "at the start", it seems to me that the intent is to not add dividers that do not provide any actual information about the cast.

Not sure if the poll was meant as "Do you want them" or "Do you think they are allowed". However, in any case, my answer is "No".
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorNexus the Sixth
Contributor since 2002
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Unfortunately the rules tell us to use them whenever possible. I'm pretty sure that was not the intent though, and the poll makes it pretty clear that most people don't want them.
First registered: February 15, 2002
 Last edited: by Nexus the Sixth
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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Quoting iPatsa:
Quote:
Unfortunately the rules tell us to use them whenever possible.

Ah, no. What it says is "Wherever possible, these groupings should mirror the film credits"
To me that means that if we use them, they should mirror the credits if possible, not that we should use them indiscriminately.
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,851
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Quoting GSyren:
Quote:
To me that means that if we use them, they should mirror the credits if possible, not that we should use them indiscriminately.

This is what the rule says:
Quote:
Dividers allow the segregation of cast and crew into logical groupings. Wherever possible, these groupings should mirror the film credits.
•Use Group dividers to designate cast grouped in the credits such as "Soldiers" or "Additional Cast".

I don't know why anyone should conclude that groups such as "Co-Starring", "Guest Star", "Special Guest Star", "Featuring", "Introducing", etc. wouldn't be considered "such as" Additional Cast.  These would all be cast "additional" to the main cast.

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 Last edited: by scotthm
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorRizor
Registered: March 13, 2007
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I would only use them if they seem like a logical grouping of different types of performers. The one title that I audited that I felt warranted it was Al Pacino's film "Looking for Richard" which used the divider "With" to credit actors who appeared as themselves within the documentary portion of the film (not talking head interviews or actors performing roles in the film-within-the-film).
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
Profiling since 2001
Registered: March 14, 2007
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I agree with Rizor. While they seem to be allowed, I don't think they are mandatory.

Since the majority does not seem to want these dividers, I would only use dividers if they actually describe the role of a group of the cast, unless Ken specifically tells us differently.

In my opinion, the cast list should let us know who was in the movie and what role they played. Trying to add dividers just to replicate the look and feel of the credits does not add any value, it just adds clutter. IMHO.
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Gunnar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributordee1959jay
Registered: March 19, 2007
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Netherlands Posts: 6,018
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I agree with Rizor as well. I don't see the point of getting anal about adding things like "And" as a divider.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorNexus the Sixth
Contributor since 2002
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting GSyren:
Quote:
Quoting iPatsa:
Quote:
Unfortunately the rules tell us to use them whenever possible.

Ah, no. What it says is "Wherever possible, these groupings should mirror the film credits"
To me that means that if we use them, they should mirror the credits if possible, not that we should use them indiscriminately.


First registered: February 15, 2002
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,202
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Quoting GSyren:
Quote:
I agree with Rizor. While they seem to be allowed, I don't think they are mandatory.

But that is the question...are they allowed.  I understand that some people might not like them, but they can't vote 'no' simply because they don't like them.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorMakoDeth
Registered: February 10, 2008
Germany Posts: 244
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
...  I understand that some people might not like them, but they can't vote 'no' simply because they don't like them.


They can and they will, because they don't like them... and it's not just group dividers or voting... Don't like the slip cover? Contribute the one you like, even write in your contribution notes that it's not the slip cover or that you don't like it and insult people who are following the rules... as long as you get enough yes votes the screeners don't care and Invelos does not care  It's annoying  But I don't care now anymore too and quit... sorry for the rant  happy easter to everyone though...
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,851
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Quoting MakoDeth:
Quote:
Invelos does not care  It's annoying  But I don't care now anymore too and quit...

My frustration level dropped dramatically once I stopped caring what's in the online database.

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