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| T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | Eddie Murphy's uncle has three credits in the database, each under a different name variant. He's credited in: 'Beverly Hills Cop II' as Ray Murphy, Sr. (41 profiles) 'Coming to America' as Uncle Ray Murphy (40 profiles) 'Harlem Nights' as Uncle Ray (14 profiles) Determining the common name is tricky - it seems we only have the number of profiles to act as a tiebreaker, but even that is extremely close together and may shift any minute. Right now, it would seem that Ray Murphy, Sr. is the common name. Now, someone has a contribution up for the US Blu-ray profile of 'Coming to America', turning his credit into "Ray Murphy [Uncle Ray Murphy]". The notes say: Quote: Corrected cast name for honorific rule (Eddie Murphy's uncle, so they added the Uncle to his credit) Four "yes"-votes, so far. Does "Uncle" really fit the honorific rule, here? And if you say "yes it does", then how would I apply the "Ray Murphy" common name to the profiles for his other two credits, knowing that he was never ever credited as "Ray Murphy"? | | | Last edited: by T!M |
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Registered: March 16, 2007 | Posts: 278 |
| Posted: | | | | Yes, Uncle fits the honorific rule. Unless his first name is indeed Uncle, it doesn't belong in the first name field.
Therefore, you have three choices.
1) Ray//Murphy, Sr. 2) Ray//Murphy [Uncle Ray Murphy] 3) Uncle Ray//
#3 is a stage name, and should probably be given less weight than the others. Unless there's evidence that a Ray Murphy, Jr. has ever been credited, I would want to give preference to #2. |
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| T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Leiterfluid: Quote: #3 is a stage name And #2 is not? The honoric rule is this: Quote: Military rank/affiliation or other honorifics should be included in the 'Credited As' field. Example: a credit of "Cpl. John Smith, USMC" should be entered as First Name: "John", Last Name "Smith", Credited As "Cpl. John Smith, USMC" When I read this, I didn't immediately think of "Uncle". I went to look for previous threads discussing honorifics, and there it was argued that honorifics " are bestowed by a recognised body of one form or another, University, medical council, army etc..." That's clearly not the case here. Instead, both #2 and #3 look like stage names to me. Either way, though, I'd still prefer to go with the name variant that is actually the most "common" in our database: Ray Murphy, Sr. | | | Last edited: by T!M |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | Seems to me it should be...
Ray Murphy, Sr. [Uncle Ray Murphy]
Because either way going by the numbers you gave Ray Murphy, Sr. is the common name. | | | Pete |
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Registered: March 20, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,852 |
| Posted: | | | | I don't know why, but when I see this subject line I keep reading it as "Horrific rule".
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | The rule on honorifics says... Quote: Military rank/affiliation or other honorifics should be included in the 'Credited As' field. Example: a credit of "Cpl. John Smith, USMC" should be entered as First Name: "John", Last Name "Smith", Credited As "Cpl. John Smith, USMC" Nothing there to say that we don't still need to use the correct common name. So the only way I would contribute... and only way I would vote yes for is... Ray Murphy, Sr. [Uncle Ray Murphy] | | | Pete |
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Registered: March 16, 2007 | Posts: 278 |
| Posted: | | | | I think that T!M's point, though, was that the new contribution for the BD release of Coming to America was that it would make the Uncle Ray Murphy credit number 41, so it would put it on par with the Ray Murphy, Sr. credit, nullifying the "common name argument" for either entry. | | | Last edited: by Leiterfluid |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | No... he said the contribution was.. Quote: Now, someone has a contribution up for the US Blu-ray profile of 'Coming to America', turning his credit into "Ray Murphy [Uncle Ray Murphy]". The notes say:
So that would make a new base name of Ray Murphy (not in the above list at all).... so it would not change the common name. | | | Pete |
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Registered: March 16, 2007 | Posts: 278 |
| Posted: | | | | Yeah, but the other 40 are all incorrect. |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | T!M can correct me if I am wrong.... but going by the OP I don't think it is a new addition to the 40... just that one of them being changed to honorific rule. Which would mean there is still just the 40 vs. the 41 Ray Murphy, Sr. so Ray Murphy, Sr. would still be the common name. | | | Pete |
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| T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote: T!M can correct me if I am wrong.... but going by the OP I don't think it is a new addition to the 40... just that one of them being changed to honorific rule. Which would mean there is still just the 40 vs. the 41 Ray Murphy, Sr. so Ray Murphy, Sr. would still be the common name. You're right. But they're close together: as soon as one or two more profiles turn op, the balance may shift. Therefore, I'd still like an answer to the question whether "Uncle" would fall under the rule on honorifics. Again, it doesn't apply now, as Ray Murphy, Sr. is the common name, but what if two more 'Coming to America' profiles surface? |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | If/when that occurs... yes I would definitely consider Uncle an honorific. | | | Pete |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 554 |
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Registered: May 29, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,475 |
| Posted: | | | | I don't consider "Uncle" an honorific either. One needs to do something to earn that honor and that is not the case here. In these cases the siblings did all the "work". |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | from Oxforddictionaries.comQuote: honorific Syllabification: (hon·or·if·ic) Pronunciation: /?än?'rifik/ Translate honorific | into Italian adjective
(of an office or position) given as a mark of respect, but having few or no duties. denoting a form of address showing high status, politeness, or respect:an honorific title for addressing women
noun
a title or word implying or expressing high status, politeness, or respect:he will be able to put the honorific after his name: licenciado, “college graduate.” I would say Uncle definitely fits well into the definition I put in bold. | | | Pete | | | Last edited: by Addicted2DVD |
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Registered: May 29, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,475 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
...he will be able to put the honorific after his name: licenciado, “college graduate.” Then we should enter his name as Ray Murphy, Sr. Uncle!?! |
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